Talk:Grammar

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[edit] Discussion from proposed wikis

This Wiki Guide to English Grammar and Usage (gegu_wiki) would attempt to explain proper grammar and usage of Standard American English in a non-technical manner aimed at practical use. While there are many good websites about grammar and usage, most of these are written by one author or are in unedited debate form. Few make clear distinctions between what rules are firm and what rules are debated or “suggested.�? It is not unusual to find conflicting advice on two different but equally reputable sites. I think this stems mostly from the debate between the prescriptive and descriptive schools of grammar. In my early years as a student of grammar and writing, I found it confusing to know what rules I should follow. Gegu_wiki would endeavor not to be a one-sided guide, but one that expressed multiple views on acceptable usage, describing what school each emanates from, and encouraging readers to decide what is appropriate for them.

Each topic—collective nouns for instance—would include two major sections: one that defines the term and describes proper use and a second on debated use. The "debate" in the main article would have to be limited to summaries of the two points of view, but could allowed to branch more widely under the discussion tab. A third major section about differences between American and British Usage would be added where the distinctions are wide enough. A limited number of links to websites from each school of thought could be given for those that wish to do further reading. In the spirit of the wiki, article form will be open to changes and improvements, but I'd like to keep it standardized across entries to increase usability.

The Wiki, as a form, is not an extended, hard to navigate technical debate, such as those that take place on grammar web boards and in linguist’s blogs. Nor is it a website with a sole author or group of like-minded authors, like many online grammar guides. This makes the wiki a perfect forum to describe the lines between prescriptive and descriptive grammar. Grammarians and linguists from both schools can discuss and edit entries in a way that is useful to readers (ie without being technical or lengthy). It is also a great way to keep track of current trends in usage and grammar.

This wiki would appeal to a wide audience. High School and College students could use this as a source to correct their papers. ESL students would benefit from the notes on differences between American and British Usage. Other readers might use it to settle an office debate on the proper use of who and whom. It will also draw linguists, grammarians, and more casual grammar geeks interested in chipping in their two cents. Special articles on “Grammar on the New SAT�? or the “A Brief History of English Grammar�? could be added to widen appeal and provide information to specific groups. Once the “grammar and usage�? core of the wiki has been formed, it could expand into related topics such as style or language history, so there is certainly room for growth. daytrod 011:42, 22 Feb 2005 (PST)

I think a grammar wiki is a great idea. You say it would focus on American English, but I wonder if this is necessary. Since American and British English (and other forms) are the same for the most part, would it be necessary to specify the wiki was for American? Would it not be better to have it generally about English, and where there are differences, document those, rather than forcing an American bias on it from the start? If this wiki were stating it was for American English usage, then another person might want to create a British English version, which would lead to a lot of duplication. Therefore, having one wiki from the start might be preferable. Angela 22:18, 22 Feb 2005 (GMT)

Great point--having one wiki for both American and English grammar would be fine with me. And what better way to identify these distinctions than to have many people from both countries helping to point out where the distinctions are? Do you think we should also include information about Canadian and Australian English? Avoiding bias is a real concern, and a big part of what I hope this wiki can do. I hope we’ll be able to present rules for multiple “schools�? of grammar and usage and allow our users to decided what is appropriate for their use. Any other thoughts, concerns, or ideas for a better title?

Also, I apologize if any of my formatting is a little odd. I’m used to a different wiki editor—a less user friendly one I might add—and am still acclimating myself to the controls. daytrod 015:54, 22 Feb 2005 (PST)

This now exists at grammar.wikicities.com. Angela 03:10, 23 Feb 2005 (GMT)